Quote from: attila on August 13, 2016, 07:14:27 pm

I used to. For the most part I very much believe most songs aren't winners. I can write an amazing chorus or melody, but that doesn't mean it's destined to be a full song. In the past I used to try writing songs from the intro through and it was a nightmare. For me there's absolutely no inspiration to be gained from starting with a beat. I realized it wasn't overcomplication I was feeling, it was genuinely a lack of direction because I literally had nothing to work from.

What did you do that helped you get past this lack of direction?

I don't go to my computer until I have a strong and clear sense of the entire song. Sometimes I'll have verse lyrics or a bridge missing, but if I don't see the whole arc of the song then I won't waste my time. I almost always start with a chorus vocally, then I go to piano/guitar/whatever I want to play on to solidify the song in my head. Also I never worry about sound design until I have the track recorded acoustically. If the energy of a song works with "organic" instruments, it'll almost always translate well to however you end up producing it.


So for example

I was showering and this instrumental popped into my head, so I rushed to the studio and put it down on guitar/piano/drums etc... along with a placeholder title (which ended up being the name of the EP...go figure)

This is the original draft from that night



Nice enough for what it is, but it obviously wasn't finished. The point was to have something significant enough to work from so writers block would be nearly impossible.

After that point it was easy, just played with the vibe and starting translating the parts to different instruments until something clicked, recorded some vocals and voila.



This has been my ritual now for the last year or two. Now note that first draft-having a "clear sense of the song"-applies only to that initial burst of inspiration. Typically my first drafts of songs are in completely different genres than the master. The point is to sit at your DAW with a sense of purpose. It's very easy to convince yourself you're having writers block after one bad session, so I do everything I can to minimize getting into a toxic loop mentally.

In the last year or so I've focused a lot more on selling transitions with strong songwriting. Sometimes I hit a roadblock and get creative with sound design.

Like ~2:18 in my last track with vocal bending

https://soundcloud.com/lyonnmusic/the-symphony

It feels like the more songs I finish the more I feel like using risers and old standard things is taking the easy way out. If the songwriting is strong the movement will already feel really good without anything else. At that point I'll add a super subtle percussive hit or quick wisp. Having vocals helps out a LOT though. I love cutting to just vocals before a section change...I'd say 75% of the time I like to bring the energy down instead of up.

~0:40
https://soundcloud.com/lyonnmusic/lyonn-well-light-the-sky

A riser can add anticipation, but I far prefer the chord progression carry the anticipation while letting the music dictate the big energy shifts. Music starts to feel too linear when it's constantly hand holding listeners to where it's going.

What you should say is that, you're learning from other's misfortune and mistakes in order to progress your individual goals.

That's definitely part of it. For me personally though, I work better creatively when I'm feeding off the raw energy of someone else's experience. It's not as logical as talking myself through why I should or shouldn't do things. I just like to internalize the overall energy of a place and run with it (whether it's positive or negative). But you could definitely say that it inevitably leads me to lump things into one or the other category because neutrality doesn't foster creativity very well. 

Only through the loss of translation, body language, and potentially lack of understanding in english word choice(as i take it you are an immigrant; from another post you've said) would i consider the last statement to be true.

Maybe body language would have sold it better, but honestly it'd probably take a more long winded conversation in person to actually explain my reasoning. Oddly enough a lot of my views stemmed from philosophy debates with my college professors. Not that that qualifies them as anything more valid, but they're not based in ignorance.

Haha I'm just being honest. I haven't given a whole lot of thought to it, but I think it has something to do with the realness of seeing so many people engage in the same destructive behavior together...it's inspiring to know I'm working on something I don't feel a need to escape from. Some people like to tear others down to feel better about themselves. I think it's a waste of time. There's plenty people out there who have already torn themselves down; you just have to observe them to reap the same emotional benefits.

When I'm in the grind of producing I always force myself to take a day off a week...not really to clear my head, but to remind myself of everything else going on in the world. It's typically Sundays. I walk around and watch people drink and do regular day off stuff. I see how so many people are literally suffering through their weeks to have this short 2 day window, that they then waste on doing nothing of value. The sadness and fragility of their existence energizes me.

Having a girlfriend is a must for me too. When I'm single I go way overboard on hours in the studio and my personality gets...weird. Super bi polar. And when your emotional state is completely riding on your performance in the studio, you spend a lot of time depressed. Except for that fleeting hour or two where you're maniacally happy, reveling in your musical genius.

Eh, in short, be honest about your personality and work around that.

Quote from: attila on August 04, 2016, 10:00:22 pm

This applies to like the .05% of producers that actually know what they're doing. I'd just go ahead and tell everyone not to do it to be safe-the people that have the understanding to pull it off will figure it out on their own.

That said, when I'm doing my final mixes and masters I try to put my head down and trust my ears instead of focusing on the meters so occasionally I can go a little hot. It's all about staying transparent though imo.

That's how some recordings got their sound, so to not even mention it removes literally years of history that's behind music production and recording.

I disagree with half of this. Yes, some controlled soft clipping has shaped the outer veneer of a few tracks, but to imply it constitutes some piece of noteworthy music history undermines the real innovations that have happened.

And obviously this is in regards to clipping as the OP presented it, not as in general distortion.

Usually when every new element I'm adding is either adding nothing compelling or covering an existing track.

Meh listening to current electronic music for mixing and mastering advice is pretty boring and only half useful imho. I think a lot of the producers most people around here would recommend for their production expertise are good because they don't mix like they're making electronic music (by which I mean club music where people are trying to find new ways of making music EVEN louder).

That said, I have a Magic A/B (amazing and underappreciated plug) preset where I typically reference a selection of tracks from:

Galantis-Pharmacy (Good for immediacy and overall pop compatibility)
Madeon-Adventure (Mostly for getting drum levels right)
M83-Hurry Up We're Dreaming (Vocal atmosphere and warmth)
Porcupine Tree-In Absentia (Clarity and mid range...make sure I'm not mixing like an asshole)
Random ELO track depending on what Im working on (overall songwriting)
Most Importantly: the last track I released (make sure what I'm currently working on sounds better)

Usually have 3 or 4 slots open where I cycle in different songs to fit the mood. Often something from Mr Bungle-California or Smash Mouth-Astro Lounge...just songs with really strong songwriting and production.

Oh I should probably add that focusing on referencing your tracks against things for the sake of scrutinizing your songwriting is more productive than trying to make your mix better. Usually if the songwriting is really strong the mix is 80% taken care of.