Author Topic: "Finished Tracks" Section Sucks rn  (Read 201532 times)

UsernamesGiveMeAnxiety

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Re: "Finished Tracks" Section Sucks rn
« Reply #15 on: January 09, 2016, 06:12:27 pm »
I definitely think the current system is flawed. For people who are really new at producing, I feel like I can't really give helpful feedback. The thing that you learn the most from at that stage is just making another track.

That's something that you can tell them! :) They may not know.

(also, your user name is overlapping the posts, so meta)

Good point!

sleepy

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Re: "Finished Tracks" Section Sucks rn
« Reply #16 on: January 10, 2016, 05:44:54 am »
I honestly don't think we need to make it so complicated. I made a post using the format I think we should use. Here it is.

Basically we link to the feedback we've left, users can see the quality of the feedback we've left for themselves, and based on that decide whether or not to leave their own feedback. We'd link to our tracks and then briefly describe what we're interested in getting feedback on. Naturally we'd want to leave feedback for the people leaving quality feedback, and no feedback for the people leaving bad or no feedback.

Simple fix, without the need for points or implementing any more coding for the forum. All we'd need is to edit the stickies :)

Mussar

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Re: "Finished Tracks" Section Sucks rn
« Reply #17 on: January 10, 2016, 05:54:06 am »
To be honest I thought you already had to comment on two other people's posts with critiques before being able to post any of your work. I'd definitely second the idea of setting a post limit (maybe Subsonics can't post new songs? Maybe even Sub Basses?), and some sort of ranking system so people can be aware of what the producer's skill level and how they should approach their feedback. It's a little frustrating to look for feedback and get "oh wow this sounds amazing great job!!!!!!" as a response, so helping people find peer groups, mentors, and pupils might be beneficial.

DANZ

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Re: "Finished Tracks" Section Sucks rn
« Reply #18 on: January 10, 2016, 07:02:46 am »
I totally agree man! I am really needing some feedback on my track, and I have left feedback for a bunch of other people! Oh well, I hope it does become real!
I got the ideas down.

ion

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Re: "Finished Tracks" Section Sucks rn
« Reply #19 on: January 10, 2016, 02:33:18 pm »
To be honest I thought you already had to comment on two other people's posts with critiques before being able to post any of your work. I'd definitely second the idea of setting a post limit (maybe Subsonics can't post new songs? Maybe even Sub Basses?), and some sort of ranking system so people can be aware of what the producer's skill level and how they should approach their feedback. It's a little frustrating to look for feedback and get "oh wow this sounds amazing great job!!!!!!" as a response, so helping people find peer groups, mentors, and pupils might be beneficial.
If the number of posts is to give people privileges, it will only amount to post whoring.  People leaving short non sense feedback.  There are already some who feel they have to comment on everything, even if they have no value in what they write.
I can only speak for myself, but I feel it´s really horrible to criticize finished work.  I mean, this is something that the creators say that they are happy with. Done. That makes it hard to say that " you should do this, and this...".
« Last Edit: January 10, 2016, 02:34:58 pm by ion »
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Re: "Finished Tracks" Section Sucks rn
« Reply #20 on: January 10, 2016, 05:04:03 pm »
To be honest I thought you already had to comment on two other people's posts with critiques before being able to post any of your work. I'd definitely second the idea of setting a post limit (maybe Subsonics can't post new songs? Maybe even Sub Basses?), and some sort of ranking system so people can be aware of what the producer's skill level and how they should approach their feedback. It's a little frustrating to look for feedback and get "oh wow this sounds amazing great job!!!!!!" as a response, so helping people find peer groups, mentors, and pupils might be beneficial.
If the number of posts is to give people privileges, it will only amount to post whoring.  People leaving short non sense feedback.  There are already some who feel they have to comment on everything, even if they have no value in what they write.
I can only speak for myself, but I feel it´s really horrible to criticize finished work.  I mean, this is something that the creators say that they are happy with. Done. That makes it hard to say that " you should do this, and this...".


It shouldn't be criticized if they dont ask for it, but I totally get where your'e coming from.
I got the ideas down.

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Re: "Finished Tracks" Section Sucks rn
« Reply #21 on: January 10, 2016, 05:56:41 pm »
If the number of posts is to give people privileges, it will only amount to post whoring.  People leaving short non sense feedback.  There are already some who feel they have to comment on everything, even if they have no value in what they write.
I can only speak for myself, but I feel it´s really horrible to criticize finished work.  I mean, this is something that the creators say that they are happy with. Done. That makes it hard to say that " you should do this, and this...".

I think that's a good point; we should try to find a way to keep people from making accounts JUST to post their tracks and not contribute, while preventing people from just spamming comments on things without genuine feedback.

And you might think it's bad to criticized finished work, but at the same time how do people grow if all someone's gonna say is "Wow, what a good song!"

I would much rather be told "Your drums are rocking, the chords could do with some work, and you could probably have spent some more time on your lead sound to get it to gel with the rest of your mix. Keep going!"

It shouldn't be criticized if they dont ask for it, but I totally get where your'e coming from.

I suppose I'm just of the opinion that posting your songs for compliments and only compliments is not a way to develop and grow as an artist. If someone says "I don't want any critiques of my work" I'm not gonna just throw shade obviously, but if you go into both the WIPs and Finished Tracks subforums almost every thread has someone asking for opinions or feedback. This is a place for people to learn from each other, and you can't learn from someone who tells you that you're doing everything correctly - otherwise there'd be no reason for you to learn in the first place!

ion

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Re: "Finished Tracks" Section Sucks rn
« Reply #22 on: January 10, 2016, 06:38:26 pm »


I think that's a good point; we should try to find a way to keep people from making accounts JUST to post their tracks and not contribute, while preventing people from just spamming comments on things without genuine feedback.

And you might think it's bad to criticized finished work, but at the same time how do people grow if all someone's gonna say is "Wow, what a good song!"

I would much rather be told "Your drums are rocking, the chords could do with some work, and you could probably have spent some more time on your lead sound to get it to gel with the rest of your mix. Keep going!"


I suppose I'm just of the opinion that posting your songs for compliments and only compliments is not a way to develop and grow as an artist. If someone says "I don't want any critiques of my work" I'm not gonna just throw shade obviously, but if you go into both the WIPs and Finished Tracks subforums almost every thread has someone asking for opinions or feedback. This is a place for people to learn from each other, and you can't learn from someone who tells you that you're doing everything correctly - otherwise there'd be no reason for you to learn in the first place!

I agree and disagree with you here, as I feel that it is easier to give out an opinion on WIPs.  I have tracks that my label has accepted the masters on, and when I get feedback saying to fix this and that... It´s just not constructive IMO.  Makes me doubt what I am capable of, as well as making me distrust the critic.  The finished section should be more of "what should I do before sending it out"-section, unless people start asking for real opinions themselves.
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Re: "Finished Tracks" Section Sucks rn
« Reply #23 on: January 10, 2016, 06:52:34 pm »
The finished section should be more of "what should I do before sending it out"-section, unless people start asking for real opinions themselves.

... What's the difference?  ???

wayfinder

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Re: "Finished Tracks" Section Sucks rn
« Reply #24 on: January 10, 2016, 07:35:08 pm »
I wonder if it would work to get rid of Finished Tracks/WIP and instead make a Showcase section that has comments turned off (so it would be +1 votes only), and a Feedback section that has comments open, with the explicit disclaimer that you'll have to expect comments there, whether you ask for them or not :)

May be too radical, but who knows?
« Last Edit: January 10, 2016, 08:28:16 pm by wayfinder »

ion

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Re: "Finished Tracks" Section Sucks rn
« Reply #25 on: January 10, 2016, 08:19:11 pm »
The finished section should be more of "what should I do before sending it out"-section, unless people start asking for real opinions themselves.

... What's the difference?  ???
The degree of completion.
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Technicolor Type

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Re: "Finished Tracks" Section Sucks rn
« Reply #26 on: January 10, 2016, 08:30:33 pm »
A thing another website I like to frequent does is C4C, which means comment for comment. That means if you tag your threads title with C4C, someone will give you feedback and put the link of their song's thread, then you are obligated to go to their thread and give them a comment. This works extremely well and has been in place for like 8 years on the other website I go on. They also have a strict rule against bumping which means the only way to keep your thread seen is to constantly be giving feedback to other people's music.

for example my title would be this
Technicolor Type - meme (psy-jazz blowjob fusion trap) [C4C]
« Last Edit: January 10, 2016, 08:33:23 pm by Technicolor Type »
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sleepy

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Re: "Finished Tracks" Section Sucks rn
« Reply #27 on: January 10, 2016, 10:34:58 pm »
I can only speak for myself, but I feel it´s really horrible to criticize finished work.  I mean, this is something that the creators say that they are happy with. Done. That makes it hard to say that " you should do this, and this...".

It's also something that the creators are asking for feedback on. Why is this even being discussed? Feedback has always been a big part of any discussion forum; the board is called "Sharing and Feedback." Personally, I feel better receiving feedback after I've finished a piece, as whenever I've received feedback on a WIP I've been sort of biased when I'd continue work on it, but I guess that's irrelevant. Feedback is a part of the forum, we should be deciding on how to make it more efficient.

I don't think it needs to be any more complicated than specifying what you'd like to get feedback on in your post. "Here's my track, I'd like to know what you guys think of x, y, and z." Simple, efficient, what else is there to say?
« Last Edit: January 10, 2016, 10:58:29 pm by sleepy »

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Re: "Finished Tracks" Section Sucks rn
« Reply #28 on: January 10, 2016, 11:00:20 pm »
I can only speak for myself, but I feel it´s really horrible to criticize finished work.  I mean, this is something that the creators say that they are happy with. Done. That makes it hard to say that " you should do this, and this...".

It's also something that the creators are asking for feedback on. Why is this even being discussed? Feedback has always been a big part of any discussion forum; the board is called "Sharing and Feedback." Personally, I feel better receiving feedback after I've finished a piece, as whenever I've received feedback on a WIP I've been sort of biased when I'd continue work on it, but I guess that's irrelevant. Feedback is a part of the forum, we should be deciding on how to make it more efficient.

I don't think it needs to be any more complicated than specifying what you'd like to get feedback on in your post. "Here's my track, I'd like to know what you guys think of x, y, and z." Simple, efficient, what else is there to say?

Give the man a cookie and he will eat it. Give the producer a section where they can post their music, they'll spam it.

sleepy

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Re: "Finished Tracks" Section Sucks rn
« Reply #29 on: January 11, 2016, 04:30:39 am »
Spam would go down drastically if we set up rules and everyone helped enforce them. You don't leave feedback? You don't get feedback, and your post gets deleted. Want good feedback? Leave good feedback and specify what qualities of your song you want to have evaluated. Simple stuff here.