Author Topic: Panning Different intances L & R (Read 24134 times)

Seneta · « **on:** January 08, 2016, 06:42:19 pm »

Sometimes I see people panning say Lead 1 (Saw pluck) and Left Lead 2 (Square pluck) Right.

I've always been against panning different elements.

Thoughts on this?

clearskys · « **Reply #1 on:** January 08, 2016, 06:45:43 pm »

You're referring to absolute or extreme panning. Synths can be either totally on a L or R channel, but this can cause binaural confusion. Your best bet is to spread the two post-fx.

If left to right is an 180 degree spectrum like on a protractor, put one synth at 45 degrees and the other at 135. Try different combinations. That way you can keep the ear interested, and you can morph between these two dimensions if the sounds are similar enough.

Kenny Troy · « **Reply #2 on:** January 08, 2016, 07:00:21 pm »

Personally, I only pan things L/R when I have the same exact channel panned the other direction. If I pan Saw 1 to the Left, I will pan Saw 2 to the right in the same manner.

I use this same "equal panning" technique for toms, one-shots, fx, so forth. Sometimes I will simply pan things both L/R, say 35%, just to create more width in my track and free up room in the dead center.

The same concept I use for individual Oscillators. For example, Sylenth1, Osc A1 and Osc A2; if I detune Osc A1 40% and pan it left, then I detune Osc A2 and pan it right.

Perhaps it's just my OCD for why I choose to equally pan these things, or maybe it is really just inexperience.

Sometimes unequal panning can give unique sounds to your track, so I wouldn't discount it entirely. Personally I just haven't hit that experienced stage in my productions yet.

Joseph · « **Reply #3 on:** January 08, 2016, 07:02:58 pm »

If you don't pan, you're tracks are going to sound kind of flat. When I produce, two of my goals are to make the EQ glow and the imager full.

Miles Dominic · « **Reply #4 on:** January 08, 2016, 08:15:33 pm »

Quote from: Kenny Troy on January 08, 2016, 07:00:21 pm

Personally, I only pan things L/R when I have the same exact channel panned the other direction. If I pan Saw 1 to the Left, I will pan Saw 2 to the right in the same manner.

I use this same "equal panning" technique for toms, one-shots, fx, so forth. Sometimes I will simply pan things both L/R, say 35%, just to create more width in my track and free up room in the dead center.

The same concept I use for individual Oscillators. For example, Sylenth1, Osc A1 and Osc A2; if I detune Osc A1 40% and pan it left, then I detune Osc A2 and pan it right.

Perhaps it's just my OCD for why I choose to equally pan these things, or maybe it is really just inexperience.

Sometimes unequal panning can give unique sounds to your track, so I wouldn't discount it entirely. Personally I just haven't hit that experienced stage in my productions yet.

You know that panning the exact same sound equally left and right does absolutely nothing to the sound stereowise?
The effect we perceive as 'stereo', comes from either a delay in time between L & R channel or a difference in frequency-content betwen L & R. Panning the same sound left and right equally, without changing anything to the time or frequency content won't make the sound more (or less) stereo.

Kenny Troy · « **Reply #5 on:** January 08, 2016, 08:30:50 pm »

Quote from: Miles Dominic on January 08, 2016, 08:15:33 pm

Quote from: Kenny Troy on January 08, 2016, 07:00:21 pm
Personally, I only pan things L/R when I have the same exact channel panned the other direction. If I pan Saw 1 to the Left, I will pan Saw 2 to the right in the same manner.

I use this same "equal panning" technique for toms, one-shots, fx, so forth. Sometimes I will simply pan things both L/R, say 35%, just to create more width in my track and free up room in the dead center.

The same concept I use for individual Oscillators. For example, Sylenth1, Osc A1 and Osc A2; if I detune Osc A1 40% and pan it left, then I detune Osc A2 and pan it right.

Perhaps it's just my OCD for why I choose to equally pan these things, or maybe it is really just inexperience.

Sometimes unequal panning can give unique sounds to your track, so I wouldn't discount it entirely. Personally I just haven't hit that experienced stage in my productions yet.

You know that panning the exact same sound equally left and right does absolutely nothing to the sound stereowise?

Maybe its the delays & reverb thrown on the specific FX I was thinking of, but stereo width aside, in regards to my track it absolutely sounds better than when I use only one layer centered.

baircave · « **Reply #6 on:** January 08, 2016, 11:04:55 pm »

So when I think about a track's mix sounding polished it often comes down to making space for everything. I think conventionally speaking an arrangement that has a ton of mid-rangey elements like say, synth chords, guitar, vocal, and piano or something, needs to be managed carefully in the mixing process. You usually want to keep your main elements (like vocals, kick, snare, or leads) in the middle but I know a lot of mixes that will pan or hard pan many elements successfully! Don't be afraid to try moving stuff out of the middle, it'll make your mixes feel way more interesting. Something I like to do is have arpeggiating elements or hi-hats oscillating from left to right so that they provide bit of left/right motion. If things are sounding a bit dense in a bad way it might not be a bad idea to try panning, even just slightly. Obviously you can EQ to help make space as well but we're talking about panning rn.

Last thing I wanted to mention is that you don't always have to have something panned right just because you panned something left. There's no hard rules! And asymmetry is cool sometimes

Kinesthetics · « **Reply #7 on:** January 09, 2016, 01:31:01 am »

Try and think of your overall project as if it were a band on stage. You wouldn't lump the singer, guitarists, bassist and drummer all into the middle; they spread across the stage and have their own space. It's helpful to break your track down into it's segments (drums, drum overheads (cymbals, etc), synths, vocals, etc), and think of how these bulk groups should have a sense of space and position.

I started doing my mixdowns in stems a year ago, and the difference in track mix quality was huge. Even just subtly panning different leads/pads/main sounds a little out to either side makes a massive difference in how your track can breathe and carry a sense of stereo space and width. Your low bass, kick, and vocals, should definitely sit in the centre, but move everything else about. Thinking with a stage band analogy helps break you away from the tiny little sonic details, and start thinking in broader aspects and overall sound, too.

FarleyCZ · « **Reply #8 on:** January 09, 2016, 02:14:01 am »

There's amazing chapter about it in one of the Owsinsi's book. Imagine it as a theatre play. Each instrument is an actor. If you leave all the instruments in the middle, they stand in line, so you can't see some of them properly. If you hard-pan everything, then you have two lines of actors on each side of the stage. Still wrong. It can lead to "big mono" effect, essentially having so much stereo information your ears give up on figuring out the soundstage. What you want is to make the stage somehow interesting. Place them incrementally around the stage.

Seneta · « **Reply #9 on:** January 09, 2016, 12:35:40 pm »

Quote from: Joseph on January 08, 2016, 07:02:58 pm

If you don't pan, you're tracks are going to sound kind of flat. When I produce, two of my goals are to make the EQ glow and the imager full.

Think you misunderstood,of course I pan,just not elements that are different. Only ones that are the exact same.

DV_ · « **Reply #10 on:** January 09, 2016, 02:45:30 pm »

@Miles Dominic explained why panning the exact same sound L and R doesn't make much sense.

Panning in general is a very useful tool, it can help you create some separation in the mix and it has many more uses.
You can also use it as a creative tool to catch listeners attention, take a listen at this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAgnJDJN4VA
The guitar that comes in at 0:09 really grabs your attention.

There are many more uses of panning that can add interest and separation to the song. You can also use it as a tool to increase the stereo wideness (just don't pan the same instrument hard L and hard R because that only makes the sound louder and not wider).

Marrow Machines · « **Reply #11 on:** January 09, 2016, 09:40:09 pm »

Doesn't seem wrong to do what you're asking. If any thing, a difference in "type of sound" doing the same thing might give you a better result. It might not thicken the sound, but perhaps add emphasis on the music component you're trying to do.

I do think that if you were to keep them on the same direction, and then process an effect on the opposite side (reverb, distortion, delay (maybe an eq to make it different)), then you could get a thicker sound from that one (of two) sound ideas. depending on how you want to layer it.

layer with more bricks and have a thicker wall, or have many thin walls?

Seneta · « **Reply #12 on:** January 09, 2016, 10:01:03 pm »

You can still layer by just panning the one instance though. You can still build a strong wall..

Marrow Machines · « **Reply #13 on:** January 09, 2016, 10:34:00 pm »

Quote from: Seneta on January 09, 2016, 10:01:03 pm

You can still layer by just panning the one instance though. You can still build a strong wall..

You might have balance issues then, and if you do have a time difference it would make that panned component stick out more (depending where you want the emphasis).

But i am not sure as to what you mean by "panning the one instance". do you mean taking both sounds and panning them opposite?(which you might need a time and or volume difference) or stacking those on top of each other and then panning them the same direction?

Author Topic: Panning Different intances L & R (Read 24134 times)

Seneta

Panning Different intances L & R

clearskys

Re: Panning Different intances L & R

Kenny Troy

Re: Panning Different intances L & R

Joseph

Re: Panning Different intances L & R

Miles Dominic

Re: Panning Different intances L & R

Kenny Troy

Re: Panning Different intances L & R

baircave

Re: Panning Different intances L & R

Kinesthetics

Re: Panning Different intances L & R

FarleyCZ

Re: Panning Different intances L & R

Seneta

Re: Panning Different intances L & R

DV_

Re: Panning Different intances L & R

Marrow Machines

Re: Panning Different intances L & R

Seneta

Re: Panning Different intances L & R

Marrow Machines

Re: Panning Different intances L & R