Author Topic: "High Resolution Audio"  (Read 10540 times)

ChayDium

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"High Resolution Audio"
« on: April 24, 2016, 07:17:40 am »
Hi everyone,

So I've been wondering, with the somewhat recent release of Sony's new line of "High Resolution audio" "mp3" players, and more recently the release of Pioneer's new NXS2 (so far just the DJM 900) line of mixers , which has been boasting about a new 96khz/64 bit audio processor,  What does this mean for digital music marketplace?
Can mp3's even be "high resolution"?, if not is Sony's new line of mp3 players just another audio product that claims to have game changing technology but is really just a gimmick and a waste of money?, do the successful artists in this forum see themselves making their tracks available for download in 24bit 48K or beyond? Has the time for the industry standard of 16bit 44.1k to finally change come?

I have been downloading all my music in lossless format for along time now and even at the current bit and sample rates the files are sizeable, so will file size deter the industry from moving to this format? or will the file size problem stop the change from ever happening?

I personally have been looking forward to the shift to higher bit depth and sampling rate files,  I think the difference in the quality of the sound even just between mp3 and lossless is well worth the extra room the larger files take up.
Ia m however, as you might be able to tell, somewhat skeptical that the shift will happen anytime soon.

A lot of of questions I know,   I am interested to hear peoples thoughts,  I find this to be a interesting subject as it could mean the beginning of a new era in sound fidelity which would change the way we hear, buy, create, and play our music......

                  Thoughts?

Mussar

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Re: "High Resolution Audio"
« Reply #1 on: April 24, 2016, 03:06:42 pm »
You misinterpreted what they were talking about. From their own website:



Nothing has changed in the industry. .mp3s and .m4as are still the same compressed formats they've always been, and are still the most popular formats for commercial distribution of music. The average ear cannot usually tell the difference between a 320 kbps .mp3 and a lossless .wav file playing the same data, because the sound isn't being pushed through powerful enough speakers. That's why Sony is offering these "Hi-Res" audio devices, which are basically just amplifiers or self-amplified devices that -can- produce the type of sonic clarity that will even notice a difference.

My personal library of music is a pretty fair distribution of mp3, m4a, mp4 and WAV/FLAC/AIFF files and even I would be hard pressed to listen to a song and be able to tell you definitively whether or not it was a compressed or lossless format just on a cold listen. I only purchase lossless when I'm able to make sure I don't have any problems when I'm DJing, but until they figure out how to compress audio without any degradation of quality mp3s are here to stay.

Marrow Machines

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Re: "High Resolution Audio"
« Reply #2 on: April 24, 2016, 03:57:12 pm »

Nothing has changed in the industry. .mp3s and .m4as are still the same compressed formats they've always been, and are still the most popular formats for commercial distribution of music. The average ear cannot usually tell the difference between a 320 kbps .mp3 and a lossless .wav file playing the same data, because the sound isn't being pushed through powerful enough speakers. That's why Sony is offering these "Hi-Res" audio devices, which are basically just amplifiers or self-amplified devices that -can- produce the type of sonic clarity that will even notice a difference.

My personal library of music is a pretty fair distribution of mp3, m4a, mp4 and WAV/FLAC/AIFF files and even I would be hard pressed to listen to a song and be able to tell you definitively whether or not it was a compressed or lossless format just on a cold listen. I only purchase lossless when I'm able to make sure I don't have any problems when I'm DJing, but until they figure out how to compress audio without any degradation of quality mp3s are here to stay.

So would you choose to play back wavs instead of 320kbps mp3 on a club or a festival system (or any mass sound system)?
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Mussar

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Re: "High Resolution Audio"
« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2016, 05:19:14 pm »
Whenever I have the option, yes. The larger the speaker and the higher the dB SPL, the more obvious the degradation, particularly in the high end.

Will the drunk, high, or rolling people notice? Probably not. Will the sober people? Maybe, but with how few people seem to wear ear protection at these events that could change. ;) But you'll definitely start to notice, and I think it's worth it in the long term to invest in something that won't risk being accentuated by a FoH limiter or a DJ Mixer's effects/EQ knobs.

Marrow Machines

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Re: "High Resolution Audio"
« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2016, 05:57:39 pm »
Whenever I have the option, yes. The larger the speaker and the higher the dB SPL, the more obvious the degradation, particularly in the high end.

Will the drunk, high, or rolling people notice? Probably not. Will the sober people? Maybe, but with how few people seem to wear ear protection at these events that could change. ;) But you'll definitely start to notice, and I think it's worth it in the long term to invest in something that won't risk being accentuated by a FoH limiter or a DJ Mixer's effects/EQ knobs.

Thank you for the insight
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FarleyCZ

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Re: "High Resolution Audio"
« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2016, 10:40:13 pm »
Any lossy compression with bitrate too low will sound worse. So yes, loseless formats are good to have.

But as far as higher bitdepths or samplerates go, imho it's totall bullcrap. It does matter when producing, so you don't have to worry about headroom too much (ability to record quiet with all the details preserved while using higher bitdepths), you don't have to worry about aliasing too much (when operating higher samplerates), but as far as distribution format goes? Total bullcrap.

Until we stop using brickwall limiters, bithdepts over 16bit will be always irrelevant for distribution. All your dynamics are happening at like upper 20% of headroom. ...with quiet parts not being quiet enough to suffer. ...may be when listening like a classic music with huge dynamic range, but otherwise no point in this. 
And as far as samplerate goes, two signals with same source in different samplerates will cancel each other out as far as your interpolation processing doesn't suck.

...imho it's just marketing.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2016, 10:42:00 pm by FarleyCZ »
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Gabe D

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Re: "High Resolution Audio"
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2016, 04:33:39 pm »
Whenever I have the option, yes. The larger the speaker and the higher the dB SPL, the more obvious the degradation, particularly in the high end.

Will the drunk, high, or rolling people notice? Probably not. Will the sober people? Maybe, but with how few people seem to wear ear protection at these events that could change. ;) But you'll definitely start to notice, and I think it's worth it in the long term to invest in something that won't risk being accentuated by a FoH limiter or a DJ Mixer's effects/EQ knobs.

Thank you for the insight

I was going to say that I would be surprised if a DJ wasn't using WAV files to mix at festivals or a club. Only makes sense to use the best quality option available.
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Marrow Machines

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Re: "High Resolution Audio"
« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2016, 08:24:31 pm »
Whenever I have the option, yes. The larger the speaker and the higher the dB SPL, the more obvious the degradation, particularly in the high end.

Will the drunk, high, or rolling people notice? Probably not. Will the sober people? Maybe, but with how few people seem to wear ear protection at these events that could change. ;) But you'll definitely start to notice, and I think it's worth it in the long term to invest in something that won't risk being accentuated by a FoH limiter or a DJ Mixer's effects/EQ knobs.
Well, could you do a successful mix of MP3 for streamed audio content?

When would it be ok to use which format?
Thank you for the insight

I was going to say that I would be surprised if a DJ wasn't using WAV files to mix at festivals or a club. Only makes sense to use the best quality option available.
Josh Huval: Honestly, the guys who are making good art are spending their time making it.