Author Topic: Producing for the mix??  (Read 8777 times)

dominique

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Producing for the mix??
« on: January 20, 2016, 10:07:04 pm »
Does anybody have some specific tips for making sure your production is suitable for a clean mix? Once I get to the mixing stage of a track I usually realize I have too many mid-range instruments, and I'm not sure how to avoid this. I know the obvious answer is "stop using too many mid-range instruments," but does anyone have a method they use to keep themselves in check while composing their track? Like for instance, how many instruments per frequency range are in a typical track of yours?

Sorry if my question is a bit unclear–wrote this in a bit of a rush. Thanks!

Marrow Machines

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Re: Producing for the mix??
« Reply #1 on: January 21, 2016, 12:59:05 am »
You have to practice good book keeping.

If you just go buck wild with out any sort of gate, you'll just end up where your question is at.

Practice being mindful.

often you will have to take multiple steps back to realize where you're at in regards to the phases of your work flow.

Out sides of technical recommendations, these are the more "philosophical" components you might be lacking.
Josh Huval: Honestly, the guys who are making good art are spending their time making it.

dominique

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Re: Producing for the mix??
« Reply #2 on: January 21, 2016, 05:45:00 am »
You have to practice good book keeping.

If you just go buck wild with out any sort of gate, you'll just end up where your question is at.

Practice being mindful.

often you will have to take multiple steps back to realize where you're at in regards to the phases of your work flow.

Out sides of technical recommendations, these are the more "philosophical" components you might be lacking.

Thanks a lot! Yeah that makes sense.

I'm just wondering what the signs are when you're starting to have too many instruments in the same frequency range. I know it will start to sound muddy, but I won't know if it's a muddiness I'll be able to fix with proper EQing or not. Is there any guideline I could follow that depends on the proximity of the loudest frequencies of 2 instruments? I often have multiple instruments in the same range, but their respective peaks of their loudest frequencies are distinctly separate. Is it just a matter of reducing dbs where the other instruments loudest frequencies are, or is it more complicated than that?

 

Dichotomy

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Re: Producing for the mix??
« Reply #3 on: January 21, 2016, 12:33:30 pm »
Does anybody have some specific tips for making sure your production is suitable for a clean mix? Once I get to the mixing stage of a track I usually realize I have too many mid-range instruments, and I'm not sure how to avoid this. I know the obvious answer is "stop using too many mid-range instruments," but does anyone have a method they use to keep themselves in check while composing their track? Like for instance, how many instruments per frequency range are in a typical track of yours?

Sorry if my question is a bit unclear–wrote this in a bit of a rush. Thanks!
What's "too many" instruments? You just need... MOAR COWBELL!! ;D Presumably, you're adding these instruments deliberately and they have purpose in your music. I don't see any reason to curtail that behavior. Just organize them in the mixdown.

If you're going for a "wall of sound" style mix, simply spread them out in the stereo field to create a fat, wide stereo image. With a lot of mid-range instruments, position them in some logical fashion... i.e. lead voices / instruments dead center & present (12:00), support & harmonics (10:30 & 1:30), etc. Panning will place them left & right (x axis). Use gentle EQ boosts to lift (highs) and lower (lows) sounds (y axis). Use volume and "effects" for presence (z axis). Use compression to "pin" an instrument in space and give it priority in that spot. Compressed sounds are less susceptible to being masked.

If you have reverb on your percussion, use a noise gate on the reverb to tame it. You'll have more room for instruments. With reverb on instruments, shortening the decay time and adding some pre-delay can open up a mix.

Also, it helps me to establish a "back wall" in the z-axis... the softest level before something sounds like unintelligible noise, and think in levels (6 usually) up to the loudest sounds on level 1. The levels don't have to be rigid (the human brain will pick out level 2.3 from 2.7 just fine), it's just a guide.

Great voice, btw!
« Last Edit: January 21, 2016, 01:13:26 pm by Dichotomy »

Marrow Machines

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Re: Producing for the mix??
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2016, 03:33:07 pm »

What's "too many" instruments? You just need... MOAR COWBELL!! ;D Presumably, you're adding these instruments deliberately and they have purpose in your music. I don't see any reason to curtail that behavior. Just organize them in the mixdown.

If you're going for a "wall of sound" style mix, simply spread them out in the stereo field to create a fat, wide stereo image. With a lot of mid-range instruments, position them in some logical fashion... i.e. lead voices / instruments dead center & present (12:00), support & harmonics (10:30 & 1:30), etc. Panning will place them left & right (x axis). Use gentle EQ boosts to lift (highs) and lower (lows) sounds (y axis). Use volume and "effects" for presence (z axis). Use compression to "pin" an instrument in space and give it priority in that spot. Compressed sounds are less susceptible to being masked.

If you have reverb on your percussion, use a noise gate on the reverb to tame it. You'll have more room for instruments. With reverb on instruments, shortening the decay time and adding some pre-delay can open up a mix.

Also, it helps me to establish a "back wall" in the z-axis... the softest level before something sounds like unintelligible noise, and think in levels (6 usually) up to the loudest sounds on level 1. The levels don't have to be rigid (the human brain will pick out level 2.3 from 2.7 just fine), it's just a guide.

Great voice, btw!

Solid response and well thought out due to experience.

I honestly don't have very many components to my song. Drums (drum set with or with out toms), Bass (sub+audible bass), Leads, Chords. I focus on getting those elements down for my music, then i look into adding layers for the bass, leads, chords, or percussion. Which eventually leads to sound effects and transitions when i have the music.

Like what the quote says, you can spread out your layers and/or decide what has purpose.

I would suggest you get the foundation of your song strong, then focus on what could be added rather than going all ADD and just doing what ever you want. Eventually you'll have to come back to organizing it if you want to make sense of it all.

Which to my point is about book keeping and purpose in your sound and creation.

It sounds like your the opposite of me when it comes to making music. I am just trying to get a right balance of musical expression with the components i have in the mix with out adding to much. You might go over board with ideas and eventually get slammed when you catch yourself. In that case, your way is fine, but i'd suggest more self control and mindful behavior. It will enhance your natural flow if you're, once again, taking a step back and focusing on the phase of work you're in. And if you aren't to keen on yourself, i suggest you start practicing that self awareness. Plus it might lead into other aspects of your life and make that better too!
Josh Huval: Honestly, the guys who are making good art are spending their time making it.

dominique

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Re: Producing for the mix??
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2016, 03:58:43 pm »
Thanks guys, really appreciate the responses. I definitely have a much better understanding now, and I like the perspective of putting the sounds on an x,y,z axis. Also really like the tip of gate on the reverb. Yeah, I think I had this tendency to just pile on synths to "beef up" my sound, and make it more powerful, when that's more of something I can fix with mixing rather than adding more sounds. I listened to a few of my favorite electronic albums last night and realized most songs only have 2 or 3 synths at a time tops, whereas I used to think just because the sound was powerful, there had to be many synths. But as I learn more about sound design and mixing I realize you can get an incredible sound with just one synth. And I heard somewhere that the industry standard is 60 or so tracks per song, but I assume the bulk of those tracks are individual one shots that make up the drums/percussion/effects. Can't believe I didn't think it was a problem to have three different pads playing at the same time–now I see that as a huge red flag.