As a general rule of thumb that i use, is that if your mix sounds good at low levels, it normally translates well at high levels, but it is rarely true the other way around. This is why i like to switch between low levels and high levels when mixing. I make sure that i can hear each element clearly at low levels. Too many times we listen to something loud and automatically think it sounds better, which is not always true. I suggest you find a low volume and try to mix into that and if your track still carries that high energy and punch at low volume, its only going to sound that much better when you turn the volume up.

Sorry if that came across as confusing lol

To add more confusion to this: A shitty or mediocre monitor controller can sound different on low levels than higher levels (especially stereo-image), that's why in my opinion the really good monitor controllers start at 1000$$ plus - but they will sound (pretty much) exactly the same on low volume as they do on loud...

That's not the case in my experience. When I chose my monitors, I tested among others Mackie HR824s. They're a true studio classic, one of the highest rated and most popular models. They sounded amazing, but only at volumes higher than what would be appropriate in a bedroom studio, among neighbours. That's the one thing that made me choose something else

Speakers have to be capable of sounding "linear" throughout different volumes too, that's right...
Haven't really worked on Mackie monitors, so I can't judge - but went through a lot of speakers myself (and still own 6 different sets that I am changing from time to time within my studio setup) - and can really say some shine on all levels, some don't on low levels for example...

Quote from: Heatcliff on January 14, 2016, 03:54:20 pm

To add more confusion to this: A shitty or mediocre monitor controller can sound different on low levels than higher levels (especially stereo-image), that's why in my opinion the really good monitor controllers start at 1000$$ plus - but they will sound (pretty much) exactly the same on low volume as they do on loud...

That's not the case in my experience. When I chose my monitors, I tested among others Mackie HR824s. They're a true studio classic, one of the highest rated and most popular models. They sounded amazing, but only at volumes higher than what would be appropriate in a bedroom studio, among neighbours. That's the one thing that made me choose something else

In my experience unless you're working on a calibrated setup (which isn't quite as quiet as you might think) then you really need to check the mix at various levels.  The ear certainly isn't "flat" in its frequency response and quiet levels are just as uneven as loud levels.

For example, your mix might sound good at low level but when you turn it up the rhythm section has no weight to it and the high mids/highs can become overbearing.  Conversely you can over process things when listening loud and when you go back to quiet then you often lose a lot of clarity.

I'm gonna go against what everybody else has been saying. I used to jump around all over the place and then I would be over tweaking until the cows came home. These days I leave it on medium (80-90db) and call it a day, until the end of a mix. It's not about losing clarity at low volumes or not enough bass at low volumes. It's about finding the factual loudness where human hearing is relatively the flattest across all frequencies. No volume is perfect, but I see a lot of this low and high volume debate, and if my own experiences are to judge, the advice here is a little misleading. When you listen to a number of mixes across the same set level, you then have a basis for your own mix, but if you keep jumping around all the time than you lose that reference. And that has the potential to have you chasing your own tail.

Just my two cents.

It seems you have a way, and that's cool.

I've had numerous people, including some to have gone on to actually become professional producers and dj's, tell me that for referencing a mix it's better to keep it at a low volume.

Now, i think the low volume thing works if you have a lot of work to do or you're doing surgical sort of stuff that doesn't require headphones. But definitely seeing how it sounds loud and tweaking it there is not a bad thing.

You're getting different and varied reference frames rather than just one perspective. It's like when you're trying to get data for what ever survey you might have a better idea of what it is you're trying to find with a larger sample size than if you were to keep it at a very low number.

But, i think the problem is not knowing where the initial reference frame should be placed. And i think that's generally reserved at a low volume (on my interface that's at the 9 o clock setting, and then with dim mode it's slightly higher and i can achieve lower volumes once at that stage).

I'm not against referencing at a higher volume. But for me I do a majority of my mixing at a fixed volume. 85db isn't all that loud actually.  I keep it at -10 on my symphony.  Towards the later stages I might turn the knob a few db to hear if everything checks out, but I rarely listen at super low volumes because that can be very deceiving. I'm not sure people listen to music at low volumes very often, and if they do they aren't paying attention (background music).  If it sounds good low-medium to high it's usually a good mix.

That's just my method.  Whatever works for you to get a good mix, all power to you.

85db is like just before what an orchestral plays before any amplification.

I get what you're saying, but you might have a better environment than most people that allows you a luxury of the loud (or necessity of the loud).

I take it you work in a bigger studio environment right?

I like to find a comfortable level using the volume knob on my interface, where all instruments are clearly heard, and simply recall that setting as my default working level. I do, however, change the level quite a lot but can always come back to the default value by the push of a button. Convenient and it works. And yeah, I don't really care about any standardized monitoring levels, not in my current room at least. It's good to check at really loud levels for any harshness in the high-mids and highs, as I've often had to get on with some de-essing action after doing so.