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Messages - Lydian

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481
Thanks so much schematic. You've literally just gave me a huge epiphany in regards to being able to match what I'm hearing from a compressor on an intellectual level. I can't wait to get home and test all this stuff out.

In regards to question #4 you mentioned that on a technical level all "glue" does to a mix is it creates slower RMS detection circuits instead of peak. What exactly does that mean? I understand that you have Peaks and RMS and that RMS is the average volume level. I don't understand what you mean by detection circuits though.

Finally in question #5 I understand what you're saying. I originally thought that the compression would only push down the kick but since its acting on everything it would also reduce the volume of the pad as well. Things are finally making sense now. Thankyou. :)

482
Answer 1: The faster the release time the quicker the full amount of make-up gain will be applied. Sort of. A slow release time will 'smooth' as you say, keeping a somewhat constant gain reduction in effect. A faster release time will continually being resetting back to 0 GR so all the bits in between loud transients are getting boosted, and overall it appears louder. With that said, the trade-off for quicker release times is that it becomes more prone to pumping, smearing, and distortion.

Answer 2: A regular stereo compressor doesn't care what frequencies it's working on, it's purely a dynamic processor so it will affect all frequencies all at once. In the same fashion as the limiter (a limiter is just a high-ratio compressor, in it's simplest form) it pushes peaks down, creating headroom so that the overall volume can be increased. It makes things sound 'loud' by reducing the gap between high peaks and low peaks. A multiband compressor does the same thing but it first splits the signal into multiple bands, and applies a compressor to each of those split bands, so each range can have it's own compression settings, unaffected by the other bands.

Answer 3: Partially answered above. As for is it 'better'... yes and no. Usually no, but that's my opinion coming from the mastering perspective, and many will argue the opposite. To me multiband is a surgical tool that should be used when everything else has failed, generally if I'm having to put a multiband comp on a master it means that something has gone horribly wrong in the mix. If you have access to each instrument, fix the problem there. Generally compression is something done to tie things together, so when you get into splitting them apart even further with a multiband things can get really messy.

Answer 3.5 (you have two question 3s!): While I said I don't like multibands on masters, they do occasionally have execellent uses in the mix. My main example would be on a distorted bassline (think neurofunk-style drum & bass) that's a bit all over the place. A multiband comp would let you tame the sub range to keep it at a constant level while still allowing the upper harmonics to have dynamics and movement.

Answer 4: "Glue" is just the term used when you're using compression to get that feel of cohesion between all of the elements, making the track feel like one thing instead of obvious layers that don't quite fit together. Often what it means at a technical level is slower RMS detection circuits instead of peak.

Answer 5: You're forgetting the element of TIME! When the kick hits, the compressor will act on everything (including the pad) pushing it all down. The kick will be finished quickly, but the pad is long so you'll hear it gradually rise back to volume as the compressor releases. So they'll never be at the same volume at the same time... they interact. But also think of the nature of a kick vs a pad, a loud transient vs a steady tone... you wouldn't WANT those to be at the same level, or the pad would sound insanely loud and the kick would be tiny. Balance does not mean everything is the same, balance means everything is comfortable relative to each other.

Answer 6: Simplest version - when you want to change the dynamic range, not the volume. Reach for the fader first, if you're finding that an instrument is standing out too much in some spots and then getting buried in others, that's when it's time to reach for the compressor.

Let me get this straight... The gain reduction is more consistent when it comes to slow release times versus fast release times. Instead of going say from -3db and back to 0 all the time it will stay at -3db gain reduction more consistently. Resulting in a more consistent volume.

A faster release time on the other hand consistently goes back to 0db of gain reduction resulting in that pumping effect.

What Im not getting is shouldn't the slower release time have less dynamic range due to the consistent 3db of compression? And by that logic aren't instruments with less dynamic range louder?

I really want to reply to the rest of these right now but sadly im at school and don't type very well on my phone. Thanks for the really detailed reply. Im gonna try to get back to you when I get home. I only had time to reply to answer 1.

EDIT: Okay so I spent some more time thinking about this and suddenly something clicked.

"A faster release time will continually being resetting back to 0 GR so all the bits in between loud transients are getting boosted, and it appears louder."

Let me get this straight. A faster release time will compress ONLY the loud transients of the waveform. This brings the louder parts CLOSER to the quiet parts.  The reason why they sound louder is because now the volume is at a more consistent level.

A slower release time on the other hand compresses not only the loud transients but all the quiet stuff that comes after that. So if a compressor was at a consistent -3db of gain reduction it wouldn't just be making the loud transients quieter. It would be making the quiet parts even quieter as well. This results in little change to the dynamic range because while you are compressing the transients they AREN'T GETTING ANY CLOSER to the quiet parts.

So in order for there to be a decrease in the dynamic range that "pumping" effect is necessary correct? That variation between the gain reduction is needed otherwise it would essentially be the same as lowering the volume fader by 3db as and calling it a day.

Maybe I'm over thinking it but is this correct?

483
I have a few questions related to compression.

Question 1: I often hear that the faster the release time of a compressor the louder the sound will be. I've noticed however that when I have longer release time on my compressor it basically "smooths" the sound out so that the quiet parts of instrument get louder. How is it that a faster release time makes things louder?

Question 2: In regards to multiband compression and normal compression what is the difference between the two? I read that a compressor basically lowers the volume of ALL the frequencies of a sound even if it's only the bass that's triggering the compressors. If that's the case then how does a normal compressor make things louder if the balance between the frequency being compressed are remaining the same?


Question 3: A multiband compressor on the other hand I heard can reduce the volume of only the bass while keeping the mids and highs uncompressed. In this case isn't the multiband compressor a better tool for achieving balance?

Question 3: What elements of a mix usually have multiband compression on them?

Question 4: What the heck is "glue" compression?

Question 5: Let's say I had a kick that was hitting at -6db and a pad that was playing at -12db. If I were to set a compressor with a -12db threshold and a ratio of 6:1 could I essentially get the kick and the pad to be playing at the exact same volume therefore improving the balance of the mix?

Question 6: When should I use a compressor vs just using a normal volume fader to balance the elements of a mix?



484
Mixing/Mastering / Re: Mixing / Mastering with Logic Pro X
« on: January 20, 2016, 09:57:59 am »
Turn off the EQ in iTunes library.

485
There are 7 types of chords.

Triads
Suspended Chords
Seventh Chords
Extended Chords
Added Tone Chords
Altered Chords
Borrowed Chords

80% of the time the chords you hear are triads. The other 20% of the time they will be the 6 latter. If you want your chords to be unique then you should explore the latter. The catch is that if you haven't first explored the former then you're going to have a hard time understanding the latter.


There are two types of chord progressions.

Diatonic
Undiatonic

80% of the time the chord progressions you hear are going to be diatonic. The other 20% of the time they will be undiatonic. If you want your chord progressions to be unique then you should explore the latter. The catch is that if you haven't first explored the former then you're going to have a hard time understanding the latter.

Finally here are some examples.

Diatonic 3:11

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-c8-kamyZE

Undiatonic

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rO1bZdtto7I

Diatonic chord progressions can be just as beautiful as undiatonic chord progressions. The only difference is that undiatonic chord chord progressions are far less used and can sound really ugly if you don't know how to use them. That's where voice leading comes in.The key to voice leading is to maintain as little movement as possible when changing from one chord to the next.

Study these chords and find out your taste. It took me years to figure out mine. Complexity isn't always better but using basic triads all the time in root position is boring. Seventh chords are a good starting point if you would like to start adding some color to your chord progressions.

Study these things in order and your chord progressions should improve.

1. Triads
2. Open & Closed Position Chords
3. Diatonic Harmony
4. Inversions
5. Voice Leading
6. Seventh Chords
7. Undiatonic Harmony

Everything else will just add extra butter. Finally as a final tip I'd like to mention that chord progressions that last 8-16 bars before looping are often more unique. The reason being that you have room for more possibilities than a 4 bar loop. Try making your chord progressions longer and maybe they may help you out.

16 bar chord progressions.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PmaFPOg14vA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xw0xdRDickg

It would be nice if you posted your music on here for me to analyze your chord progressions.

486
I'd say that i still have quite a ways to go but im glad to have made the decisions that i did to get me to where i am now. My biggest hope is to eventually be able to compose memorable and beautiful tracks that i can consider immortal like this one

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yPa5DSJPjM&list=RD6yPa5DSJPjM

That is quite an interesting producer.

487
Finished Tracks / Re: Xevious - Tears Of Trinity
« on: January 18, 2016, 09:41:39 am »
Well it's definitely pretty coming in :)

The percussion definitely needs work though. I can't tell if the drums you're using are of bad quality or just sound off because they're muffled by everything else. I feel like I would really like the snare if I could hear it more (where's that sample from? Has an almost exhale-like quality to it) Maybe make them a little louder and look into sidechaining a little more?

Also, LOOOVE the little pluck thing sequence that comes in at around 0:20. And the background LFO thing that fades in at around 0:32 and 0:44 is cool too (is that just same little pluck thing?). I love little details like that. The riser at around 1:30 is nice. Basically lots of nice sounds haha.

I think your track could use a bit less reverb and some more high end stereo presence, or just more high end in general. It sounds a little bit muffled, and lacks that airy feel I like to hear a lot in these pretty type tracks.

Good structure, the song doesn't get boring, even though it's a lot of  repetition. It has just enough variation to keep me interested, and musical elements (chord progressions, melodies, etc) don't sound cheesy. So keep up that standard.

The track sounds cool, you're headed in the right direction. Keep it up! :P

Thanks for giving the song a listen. :) What I think you're hearing at 0:32 is the same square (Pluck) lead that plays at 0:20. What I did there is I got the sound and I cut it up into 1/32 notes. I then pasted it into a bunch of repeating 1/32 notes so it created a glitch effect. Then I just did some volume automation to get it to fade in and fade out.

I hear what you're saying about the high end. I don't think it helps that the high hats in this track are really screwed as far as stereo goes. I believe they're to wide to the point that they're phasing. Young me didn't care though cause the wider I thought the better. :P

I think the bad quality of the drums had to do with the mix. I don't even think I knew how to side chain at this point. The reason why the snare has an exhale quality to it is because it's actually a clap thats playing. xD Unless you're talking about the part at 0:58. I'm not to sure where that was from to be honest. I can't remember but I do know that I definitely abused the reverb on that. Or maybe you're talking about the part at 1:46. Those snares were just some vengeance samples that I didn't even layer because I didn't even know how to layer. All the drums in here were vengeance samples actually. I probably just killed them with my terrible mixing because I've heard them sound good in other tracks. Ahahaha!

I appreciate the listen once again sleepy.


488
Whether a loop is in a minor or major key is determined by the tonal center of the loop. It CANNOT be both at the same time. However like deathy says below it can work for both depending on the circumstances of the loop.

Is it necessarily either?  If it only uses the 1st (F), 2nd (G) and the 5th (C), then it works for both.  In my sample collection, most of the time, when there's no M or m, then it has been both.

Let me clarify a bit on what deathy is trying to say here.

The notes in F Major are F, G, A, B♭, C, D, and E
The notes in F Minor are F, G, A♭, B♭, C, D♭, and E♭.

Notice how all the notes in these two keys are different aside from the 1st (F), 2nd (G) and the 5th (C)?

If the loop uses these three notes then the loop can POTENTIALLY be used in either of these keys. However it CANNOT be in both at the same time. To tell whether a loop is in F major or F minor listen to the notes. Listen to the chord progression. Does it sound like a F minor chord is the home of the loop? If thats the case then the loop is in F minor. If it sounds like an F Major chord is the home then the same rules apply. The most important thing is to listen to the cadence (resolution) of the bass.

489
Finished Tracks / Re: Finally finished my EP, Looking for feedback.
« on: January 15, 2016, 05:28:06 pm »
Love the jazzy chord feel in the intro. The dubstep that came after it didn't seem to fit in my opinion.

490
When I started producing I was told that you should always mix with some headroom in order to avoid clipping. If I were to start with the kick at 0db then the minute I added a second element such as a snare the mix would start clipping. It always made sense for me to lower the faders in the mix and then increase the volume using a limiter during mastering in order to get that 0db hit from the kick.

Then again I've heard and seen some pretty weird production methods. Deorro who went to my high school and came from the same city as me mixes with nothing on his master. He self taught himself almost everything since he was homeless at a point and didn't have money to afford wifi to watch tutorials.

I love Deorro! Have you had a chance to check out his interview at Ignorant Philosophy?

I recently learned that the way you master/mix/produce is completely up to you. I always thought it was good to leave some headroom but after hearing Flux say some of his tracks go into the red, I just do whatever sounds good now.

I actually haven't seen that interview. It's amazing to see how he blew up. He dated my sister and used to come over to my house when I was real young. (6-7 years old) We just called him Eric though. Never thought he would end up getting big and blowing up. Back when he was Ton!c he would trade CDs with my sister and we would listen to them in our spare time.

Here he was.



I feel like there are two ways mixing & mastering. You have the people who are very strict with keeping nothing on the master at all times and then you have the people who do both simultaneously. I know that madeon and zedd have mentioned that they mix with stuff on their mastering chain.

491
When I started producing I was told that you should always mix with some headroom in order to avoid clipping. If I were to start with the kick at 0db then the minute I added a second element such as a snare the mix would start clipping. It always made sense for me to lower the faders in the mix and then increase the volume using a limiter during mastering in order to get that 0db hit from the kick.

Then again I've heard and seen some pretty weird production methods. Deorro who went to my high school and came from the same city as me mixes with nothing on his master. He self taught himself almost everything since he was homeless at a point and didn't have money to afford wifi to watch tutorials.

492
I wouldn't say that counterpoint is anywhere near as important in electronic music as it is say baroque music or orchestral music. It's still very useful to know however because in the case that I want to have two melodies I understand how to write one so that it doesn't conflict with the other. As far as part writing goes the main time I'll incorporate it is when I'm using strings in my music. Occasionally I might want to arrange one section of the song in strings and then transition it back into electronic elements. The voice leading that you learn from part writing really helps when it comes to smoothing out your chord progressions. Whenever I write my chord progressions I try to write them them with part writing rules in mind. Contrary motion between the bass and soprano with as little motion as possible within the inner voices (alto & tenor). I don't ALWAYS stick to it though. I break the rules just as often as I incorporate them so in the end it's a neat tool to incorporate when you get stuck.

Bottomline is they aren't necessary for writing electronic music but incorporating them in the correct spots will make your music just that much more unique. I remember for example the first time I heard zedds "shave it up" I immediately stopped what I was doing because it so unique for me to hear counterpoint in electronic music.

0:25 & 2:27 are examples of what you can do in electronic music with the knowledge you learn from part writing & counterpoint. https://www.youtube.com/embed/G5l3xhEGxqw

493
12. Starting playing guitar when I was 12 and got serious with it when I turned 13. Thought I was going to be a professional guitar player. Practiced 10 hours a day on weekends and 6 hours a day on weekdays. Studied music theory religiously like a savant and got my hands on any online pdfs I could get ahold of. Found a mentor on the ultimate guitar forum who taught me about more advanced theory topics like counterpoint.

13-14. Started a youtube channel at 13 and uploaded guitar covers for 2 year. Reached 1 million channel views and became moderately internet famous in my niche. Got retweeted by a couple of the bands I was covering. Stopped doing covers at 14 because I decided I was tired of learning other peoples music.

15. Joined the marching band at my high school at 15 and learned how to read music notation. Taught myself how to use music notation software (Sibelius 7) and transcribed 2 albums worth of guitar notation. At this age I began I was starting to hear music in numbers. Hearing the chord progressions became very natural to me and I could essentially listen to 80% of music and replay it on the spot.

16. Homeschooled my junior year of high school and after listening to guys like Taishi, Zedd, Madeon, & Porter Robinson decided that I had reached a peak in my guitar playing and would give electronic music a try. I had already been listening to electronic music since I was a baby because of my dad who was a DJ and used to play old school ATB, Above & Beyond, Armin Van Buuren & Tiesto. Got myself a copy of Logic Pro and spent a considerable amount of time learning the ins & outs of audio engineering, sound design, and music composition. Spent almost every day in frustration as I quickly became overwhelmed by the sheer difficulty of trying to learn everything at once. Made some really bad music.

17. Went back to high school my senior year and decided that guitar wasn't my calling after all. Taught myself how to play bass, piano, & DJ. Finally started to hear what was wrong with all my bad music and got just a little bit better. Learning to DJ helped me get a better ear for arrangements and learning piano made it easier to come up with interesting chord progressions.

18.(Now) Started full time college & working 32-40hours a week. Bought myself an electronic drum kit and started teaching myself drums using superior drummer. Finally at the point where I'm able to identify my music composition tastes but am still struggling with arrangements and mixing. Signed up to a Mat Zo forum to hopefully find some tips as whatever amount of free time I have goes to music.


Where am I headed? If I'm not good at this by the time I'm 26 probably nowhere. It's been 6 years since I've gotten into music but only 2 since I started producing. Those 2 years weren't always the most dedicated but I've still come a long way and have become a lot better.

494
WIPs / Re: ditch or carry on working on it? (progressive trance)
« on: January 14, 2016, 06:57:44 am »
I listened to the new version. I was sad when I found out you removed the lead in the drop. :( I really liked it. Just throwing out my thoughts.  :-X

495
WIPs / Re: New DnB Track | Hows The Mix?
« on: January 14, 2016, 03:38:21 am »
I'm going to try out your recommendation as soon as I get home from school mox. Thanks so much for your feedback. Maybe I'll try adding a little reverb onto the hi hats so that the drums don't sound so dry.

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