Author Topic: Repetition: How Much is Too Much?  (Read 16073 times)

Zehmli

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Re: Repetition: How Much is Too Much?
« Reply #15 on: January 12, 2016, 03:37:56 am »
I always go by groups of three because that's what's most numerically pleasing to the brain. Like if I hit three repetitions, then I change it up.

guillotine

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Re: Repetition: How Much is Too Much?
« Reply #16 on: January 12, 2016, 11:41:01 am »
If I had something repeating for 4 bars usually I add some elements on top every 8 bars, maybe adding a fill or a melody variation before the 8th bar. Of course, it depends on what you're going for at the end of the day, but them tips might help.

Maxwellywell

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Re: Repetition: How Much is Too Much?
« Reply #17 on: January 13, 2016, 05:10:54 am »
Like others have said, it really depends on the style.

Recently I've been making a lot of tech and minimal house, and repetition is key to give it a steady, "rolling" groove. This is even more important when performing live, especially in a clubby environment. When performing, a good trick is to have a distinct pattern which you can revert to at anytime. If you're feeling adventurous, switch it up! But keep your tempo steady so that you can go back to same groove whenever you want.

As for producing, another trick I like is to make slight variations rather than adding whole new elements. An extra hi hat beat in a pattern can keep a groove remarkably fresh, even if you did not change much.

After looking at this post, songs I like and my own projects, I would agree that changing up every 8 bars is pleasing to the ears, however, like all rules of music, this one's meant to be broken.

manducator

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Re: Repetition: How Much is Too Much?
« Reply #18 on: January 13, 2016, 04:11:30 pm »
Interesting question about repetition. I like techno and minimal, genres that are all about repetition but... the repetition isn't static.

Although a groove, a certain pattern is repeated, you sould add variation with filters, envelopes, adding white noise,...

Someone refers to Richie Hawtin (I love his music) and yes, it's all about repetition but don't be deceived, the movement in his music is always dare. Repetition without movement is boring, no matter which great artist created it. The art is creating something that 'feels' repetitive but in fact it isn't.

Th devil is in the details; automation of the cutoff point of a hihat sample will not be noticed by many listeners but it's stuff like that, that aks you go 'It's repetitive but not boring, how come my music isn't as interesting as that?'

Best advice I can give; create a groove and take a good look at the knobs of your synth, imagine which functions you could automate. Basically if you are creating minimal music and there isn't any automation going on, that's not a good sign. People always expect variation. Some kind of predictable change.

Richie Hawtin's music isn't about surprise but movement is there, always.

auvic

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Re: Repetition: How Much is Too Much?
« Reply #19 on: January 14, 2016, 03:13:09 pm »
It's all subjective. I've had people that listen to the same song and the ones that LOVED the song said it wasn't repetitive enough, and the ones that didn't care for it that much said it was too repetitive.

adrianduff

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Re: Repetition: How Much is Too Much?
« Reply #20 on: January 15, 2016, 01:46:33 am »
I used to think that you 'should' add something new every 8 bars, but then i discovered a techno track in Richie Hawtin's latest compilation that is 16 minutes!! Only dark groove and acids, there's nothing much happening but i enjoyed every single bit of it. This taught me a great lesson that if you find a part interesting you can stretch it as long as you want, if you can listen to this part for 1 minute without waiting for something new then go for it! The track: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=59cxgdJW9UM

I generally agree, but I keep in mind that the things that can be added every 8 bars can be as simple as a little bit more cutoff on your synth, a couple of extra hi hats in your sequence....doesnt have to be a huge change.  I think often it is the really subtle changes that make a wicked tune, cause you're sitting there like, I dont even know whats going on but this is awesome!

Bertie South

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Re: Repetition: How Much is Too Much?
« Reply #21 on: January 15, 2016, 06:40:34 pm »
Interesting question about repetition. I like techno and minimal, genres that are all about repetition but... the repetition isn't static.

Although a groove, a certain pattern is repeated, you sould add variation with filters, envelopes, adding white noise,...

Someone refers to Richie Hawtin (I love his music) and yes, it's all about repetition but don't be deceived, the movement in his music is always dare. Repetition without movement is boring, no matter which great artist created it. The art is creating something that 'feels' repetitive but in fact it isn't.

Th devil is in the details; automation of the cutoff point of a hihat sample will not be noticed by many listeners but it's stuff like that, that aks you go 'It's repetitive but not boring, how come my music isn't as interesting as that?'

Best advice I can give; create a groove and take a good look at the knobs of your synth, imagine which functions you could automate. Basically if you are creating minimal music and there isn't any automation going on, that's not a good sign. People always expect variation. Some kind of predictable change.

Richie Hawtin's music isn't about surprise but movement is there, always.

+1, well put. Some of my favourite tunes (particularly old proggy stuff) are deceptively un-repetitive. I think modulation and automation are the keys to this, as much as if not more than, adding elements or taking them away. Changing what's already there instead of adding new bits.

The other thing I would say is to make sure your sounds are on point and high quality in the first place - sometimes it's not repetition that's the problem but what you're repeating.

A couple of my favourite tunes that don't really seem to do much:

Dirty Mongrel - Cream (Wiretappeur Remix) - Bedrock
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EC-RwN06hhc

DAVI - Black Rock City (Robert Babicz Spaced Out Cosmic Remix) - Subtract Music
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lIwnDu0R1Tw
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